Bradley Milton Coombe + Lawyer = Lano Shutdown

[Thomas Crown]

What the shit happened to being accountable for your own fucking actions?

[Foofie Foofie]

We get ass raped for no helmet and such on the roads, how about bringing in a $1,000 fine for not wearing a helmet in the dirt?

/rant

Mick

Mick, Agree.

I also would agree with jackets, gloves and full pants on road bike TO BE LAW, or a 1000 dollar fines. Stop fuckwits like the guy on the super impressive stock 07 R6 who rode up my street on friday at about 120kph in nothing but a $200 lid , shorts, shirt, no gloves and runners.

[thro]

More seriously...

Would "expert legal testimony" (eg, someone, or several PSB dirty riders) help the shire of gingin's case if used appropriately?

If soemone mentioned that there are stickers on his bike, words in the owners manual, etc saying that riding is inherently dangerous, to wear gear, etc?



As to the legal requirements to wear gear off-road. Disagree. Gene pool needs a bit of chlorine, by the looks of things...

[Scoundrel]

Another one bites the dust.....

It was just on the news that a 20 yo man and his female passenger went C.Up on their quad at Lancelin today...... He can't feel his legs, she was knocked unconscious.

Mick

If that's the case, and he tries to sue the Shire, he's gonna be shit outta luck because the ORV area has been officially closed for the past 6 months.

Thro, that sort of thing was covered in the District Court's judgement, although it didnt cover the warning labels on the motorbike, it made specific mention of the warning signs at the ORV area. Which is probably the reason why the court apportioned "only" 60% blame to the Shire and the rest to that halfwit. They said that going there and using the area carried an inherent element of risk and the signs said so, but the Shire could have done more (apparently) to make people aware of the risks.

IMHO all the warning labels and signs in the world arent going to make a difference in this day and age where personal responsibility means nothing with a legal system that panders to stupid people and doo-gooders.

[mattski0_0]

One of my friends was looking into purchasing the Lancelin dirt bike hire mob, had everything ready, but isn't going to do it now. Especially when all he could end up purchasing is a lot of bikes and nowhere to ride them.

[thro]

IMHO all the warning labels and signs in the world arent going to make a difference in this day and age where personal responsibility means nothing with a legal system that panders to stupid people and doo-gooders.

Oh don't get me wrong, I agree, but unfortunately we're forced to play the game.

Given that he either
1. knows riding is dangerous, and decides to anyway
or
2. did not read his owner's manual

He's either

1. a liar by claiming he had no idea what he was doing was potentially dangerous
or
2. negligent


Just frustrates the hell out of me, surely if a group of perth dirt bike riders were to volunteer to testify that any fool who owns a dirt bike should have known better, there must be *something* that can be done?

Perhaps the shire could fence and post signage around teh off-road area off in a show of prevention (but not lock the gate), and then just not police it?

Surely then, if someone was to attempt to sue them they could point out that they were illegally trespassing and rode past a heap of signs saying "danger" etc... and be legally not responsible in any way?

[M.J]

What it comes down to is that if you get on any vehicle, recreational device, that is dangerous to the point where an accident resulting in personal injury occurs then YOU SHOULD BE RESPONSIBLE !!! End of story. If you cant pay the bills due to your injury then it is YOUR problem. Before undertaking any such risks, weigh it up and if you cannot afford to do it then stay away until you can.

[shmoo]

What it comes down to is that if you get on any vehicle, recreational device, that is dangerous to the point where an accident resulting in personal injury occurs then YOU SHOULD BE RESPONSIBLE !!! End of story. If you cant pay the bills due to your injury then it is YOUR problem. Before undertaking any such risks, weigh it up and if you cannot afford to do it then stay away until you can.

Its all well and good to say that, but it doesnt excuse the government/whoever being negligent. There are certain things that "the average person" expects and that is what is being raised here. The decision of the court seems to suggest that "the average person" expects appropriate signage/fencing, and in this case the judge decided that that responsibility had not been met by the shire.

What if there is a giant great hole in the middle of the freeway that the government knows about but doesnt bother fixing. Then you crash into it. But going by your statement, that would be stiff shit because you know driving is dangerous so its your problem if something happens. See it just wouldnt work.

[Thomas Crown]

What if there is a giant great hole in the middle of the freeway that the government knows about but doesnt bother fixing. Then you crash into it. But going by your statement, that would be stiff shit because you know driving is dangerous so its your problem if something happens. See it just wouldnt work.

Giant hole in a freeway isn't exactly a pile of sand in an off road area.

At least compare apples and apples.

[Mungus]

Its all well and good to say that, but it doesnt excuse the government/whoever being negligent. There are certain things that "the average person" expects and that is what is being raised here. The decision of the court seems to suggest that "the average person" expects appropriate signage/fencing, and in this case the judge decided that that responsibility had not been met by the shire.

That wouldn't work up at Lancelin I'm afraid. You see, it's windy up there and the dunes are made of sand - THEY MOVE. If you're going to go up there, you need to take responsibility for yourself. If that means doing a reconnaissance before the real stuff, then that is what needs to be done.

[Dryza-nuns]

Giant hole in a freeway isn't exactly a pile of sand in an off road area.

At least compare apples and apples.

Yep, thats what I reckon too.
Lancelin is a dangerous place.... no 2 ways about it.
I have done a collar bone up there after dropping off a 3 foot drop into a pool of powder on my CRF....but thats tuff titties and comes with the territory. (I was wearing Helmet, MX Boots, MX Pants, MX Shirt, Knee Brace and Armour all on a 40 degree day mind you...could have been alot worst, but I just don't get on the dirt bikes/quads without the gear on)

When you see people suing cause they didn't realize they could hurt themselves due to lack of signage makes me f#*king wild. I mean come on?

My comment in a previous post about hefty fines for no helmets applies to every riding area. The amount of snappers you see at the pines wearing nothing else but a flannel shirt and sneakers pegging top gear on the limestone straight tears me up!
(It's like they don't want to wonder off too far cause their mates and missus waiting at the car can't see them anymore)

Anyway, I feel this is a dead end argument as society these days seems to have accepted that common sense is not an individuals responsibility.

Mick

[Karlos]

Thats a joke, becoming more like the yanks everyday

Oh, i fell over - I'm gonna sue your arse!

[shmoo]

Giant hole in a freeway isn't exactly a pile of sand in an off road area.

At least compare apples and apples.

well like it or not, this case has proven that there are similarities.

The example was purely to illustrate the point that local governments have responsibilities and thats a fact of life, regardless of how much we hate the outcome in this particular case.

[shmoo]

That wouldn't work up at Lancelin I'm afraid. You see, it's windy up there and the dunes are made of sand - THEY MOVE. If you're going to go up there, you need to take responsibility for yourself. If that means doing a reconnaissance before the real stuff, then that is what needs to be done.

I was talking about what has actually happened with regards to this case, thats all. I agree completely, but you've got to accept that "take responsibility for yourself" doesnt mean what you and I think it should mean.

[Brougham]

in regards to the shire's problems, what should happen is hiring someone(people) and give them a little air-con'ed booth at the entrance to the road and have them either give a simple flyer stating that entrance is at own risks, is dangerous, yadda yadda, or have them make them sign a waiver against injuries, etc before entering the park.

[Barfrangipani]

Brougham: the problem with that is if they control entrance to the park, they are then seen to have control of the interior of the park

[thro]

Alternatively...

Annual "off-road" permit of say $50/yr (enough to pay for administrative costs), requiring the signature of a waiver absolving the shire, and make it a massive pineapple for riding there without a permit.

[JimmyO]

i think that seeing as the guy himself saidf that he had been riding dirt bikes since he was eight (about 20 years for him) and claims that he didnt know riding in the dunes was dangerous.... cmon thats gotta be bullshit. i mean ive only been riding for 6 months and only been up there a coupla times and i knew it was dangerous from the start. if i crashed id take it on the chin and not try to pass the buck

[Scoundrel]

Alternatively...

Annual "off-road" permit of say $50/yr (enough to pay for administrative costs), requiring the signature of a waiver absolving the shire, and make it a massive pineapple for riding there without a permit.

They already have this...Off Road Vehicle Licences. The condition on the rego is that you can only use the vehicle in GAZETTED off road areas like Lanno. However, that gives indemnity to the State only, not the Shire.

And from what I can gather annual ORV rego is a pittance.

[shmoo]

Alternatively...

Annual "off-road" permit of say $50/yr (enough to pay for administrative costs), requiring the signature of a waiver absolving the shire, and make it a massive pineapple for riding there without a permit.

This is a really good idea.

The "license" lasting 1yr should be payable in advance or "at the door" and should be enough to cover the shires costs and also for an insurance policy so the shire is not out of pocket. The perfect user pays system, then the shire is not disadvantaged at all by keeping it open.