nuts, bolts and chaos theory for non mathmatically minded..

[g0zer]

.. and torque wrenchs

its occured to me while doing up the hundreds of nuts and bolts lately

that to pinch a bolt up gently
you tighten 3 times
if its a vulnerable material like aluminium or wood i will make it 5 to be careful

beyond period 3 is chaos

you try and try and try again.. and the bolt will come undone but not before i want it to

which is the whole point of doing something up without breaking it

mechanical sympathy is another name for it

it occurs to me that you dont have to be mathmathically minded to grasp it- lots of people twiddling spanners aren't good at math

[sathid]

Exactly how does this relate to chaos theory?

[g0zer]

from Chaos theory - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Minimum complexity of a chaotic system


Bifurcation diagram of a logistic map, displaying chaotic behaviour past a threshold


Simple systems can also produce chaos without relying on differential equations. An example is the logistic map, which is a difference equation (recurrence relation) that describes population growth over time. Another example is the Ricker model of population dynamics.
Even the evolution of simple discrete systems, such as cellular automata, can heavily depend on initial conditions. Stephen Wolfram has investigated a cellular automaton with this property, termed by him rule 30.
A minimal model for conservative (reversible) chaotic behavior is provided by Arnold's cat map.

also re paper beyond period 3 is chaos


i guess it relates (re: Exactly how does this relate to chaos theory? -sathid) because

umm


i guess what im saying is
twiddling spanners on motorcyles is some kind of vorrtex that the human condition easily gets sucked into

[RICO]

Erm do you meen doing something up and then loosening it, and repeating this 3 times, if so thats not chaos theory that's OCD

If your paranoid about breaking bolts etc, then use a bolt torque chart to properly ascertain the correct torque for that size bolt/nut, which can be gauged by the numbers/letters that are on the top of bolt/nuts.

I have one, I will find it for you, Cause it must take you bloody ages working on bikes, if you do everything 3 times

[g0zer]

no no no


its lilke you tighten ing then dont tighten
then tighten again

yeah thats tight enough

and its sweet! it wont come undone and the next person (prob u) who comes along to remove it, will be able to

[RICO]

Oh right, now i get it, and yes I do swing spanners for a living

I wish someone had adhered to this, when they done desmo's sprocket carrier nut up, that was fucking tight for 156Nm

[sathid]

So what you are saying is that at 3 tightens you are relatively certain that it can be undone, but won't come undone, but that with more than three, your degree of uncertainly drops off sharply, and you have no idea if it will break, come loose, or be too tight to be undone without damage?

[g0zer]

the human condition is defined by taking at least 5 goes at something

within that number anything is possible

edit: lol@rico

make sure you put it on real tight for him rico!

otherwise he will blame you if it falls off

[g0zer]

sathid-

its like music

there are only 5 notes

within 5 notes, there is an infinite number of
possibilities
beyond period 3 there is chaos

thats why if you pinch 3 times or more it will always come undone
you just need to be careful not to strip the thread

if you make a habit of using threadlock you dont need to worry about it coming undone

and you can pinch lighter and stuff like threads and bolts last longer

which is a good thing with jap bikes which are made mostly of soft metal like aluminium

[g0zer]

its als related to white bys cant dance but thgats racist and misogistscistc

[XSorXpire]

I'm a bit lost.

[XSorXpire]

OH i get it now.
You guys are all nuts, once the whores get a hold on the thread it will bolt in different directions and be chaotic.
Is that the theory?

[faultykyle]

WHORE HERE

There aren't only 5 notes in music, notes go from A through to G with flats and sharps along the way XD

Continue.

[XSorXpire]

But there are only five notes in the Australian currency.

[Sprint]

And five of you have posted (damn... i'm six).

S.

[sathid]

Besides, what do you mean by there being infinite possibilities within 5 notes?

I'm not so sure that music is chaotic. If you start a song in the middle, the end of the song will still sound the same as if you started right from the beginning. That pretty much goes against the number one premise of chaos theory - that small changes in the initial conditions of a system, result in vastly different conditions down the track.

Or were you meaning something else by 'music' ?

[XSorXpire]

So in theory.
If you turned up to work, the door was locked for the first half hour and you could not get in, then your work week by theory could become chaotic?

[Billywhizz]

I am totally lost in here

[sathid]

I suppose there is an endless number of possibilities for what you could do if you aren't at work.

[Billywhizz]

Here

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