Learning...

[Xuaxace]

So well, i got my bike 1 month ago, the almighty zzr love it.
Well it took me 3 weeks to get insurence so ive only been riding outside for a week, ( i was riding in my driveway for those 3 weeks)
Well so i started going to the car park than the road a week ago, got used to the gears , Nice O-U turns breaking etc.
So now im pretty much confident with my riding, and i can do short distance trips within the suburb.
Question tho, I dont ride with shadow. how bad is that? People learning always go out with shadows or instructors aye? never alone.
I was short of wondering how you other people started? did you guys went straight to the instructor or shorta played around with the bike?

Right now i dont have any mates with bikes so i cant go ride with anyone of them, one of them is getting a bike soon but not now.

So now that im shorta confortable with my riding what should i be doing?
Getting an instructor , get a few leassons and go for the test?
Im still 16.5 years old.. still need another month to be able to do the rest

Oh another question, I think that when people have their cars lisence they only need to do their practical r-e test and they get their full lisence right?
In my case im probably going to end up doing my bikes first, so does it work vice versa? probably not ay.. but worth the try.
So i think it would be wiser to just get my cars, and then just do the bikes aye?

anyway.. any answers to this would be helpful
thanks people

[Tenchi]

Congratulations for starting the on two wheel road, I too love the ZZR250 although I'm ready to move on to bigger and better things. For the record, the only time I rode without a shadow was doing O-turns out the front of my house, and my dad (who has had his licence for at least 20 years) was watching over me - officially not a shadow, but almost as good.

Question tho, I dont ride with shadow. how bad is that?
How long is a piece of string? Very bad. Pineapple territory. How bad is getting caught driving around with L plates on and no supervisor? At the very least, it will cost you precious demerit points and/or money. At worst might cost you your licence/permit which makes insurance harder to get (and for you, insurance is going to hurt a lot). Don't be stupid, save yourself the trouble, just ride with a shadow.

People learning always go out with shadows or instructors aye? never alone.
Consider this: if you didn't have your licence and you hit someone, insurance will NOT cover you. I'm not sure how insurance works out with a shadow, but I suppose it's more legal than not having a shadow. If you hit me and you had no insurance, I would take you to court and get as much money as possible. If I didn't have time to do that, I'd claim it on my insurance and have THEM take you to court and get as much money as possible. I'm no lawyer, but "buttfucked" comes to mind. And I'm a nice person - imagine if I wasn't a nice person. There would be beatings involved, as well as all of the above.

I was short of wondering how you other people started? did you guys went straight to the instructor or shorta played around with the bike?
First 2 hours: Steve (legal shadow) took me to Neil Hawkins and got me to ride the bike around there for 2 hours. Neil Hawkins is a car park in Joondalup with a 5º incline through most of the car park. Take your bike there and you won't have much trouble handling it. Just don't do what my lovely gf did and drop your bike trying to do o-turns on a hill (much harder than o-turns on flat ground).
After that: 1 hour lessons with instructor, lots of shadowing whenever Steve could spare the time. Ended up doing about 21 hours of riding before my test (god bless you Steve). Blitzed the test.
In hindsight: Should have learned (at least) how to emergency brake/brake at all on an incline before taking it to neil hawkins. Almost dropped the bike the first time I went out. Front brake bad.

So now that im shorta confortable with my riding what should i be doing?
Learning with an instructor, booking your test in. There's a decent waiting period last time I checked. Get your theory downpat on where to ride (roadcraft), what to do in situations you think you may encounter, and when you travel in the car start doing head checks - it will help you ease into road riding because you will be doing head checks at every street for your test. Go through the R-E/R test sticky and find what other people suggest to do - there's a lot of good suggestions in there.

Getting an instructor , get a few leassons and go for the test?
Im still 16.5 years old.. still need another month to be able to do the rest
Sounds about right. Most people need 4-6 lessons (number varies) before they do their test; one a week = 1 month, assuming you can actually book your test in. I personally recommend Elite Motorcycles, a couple of their instructors are on the forum, I went through John's Motorcycles in Joondalup; I feel that my learning was substandard from John's compared to what my girlfriend learned from Elite M/C - Elite really helped her above and beyond what I got.

Oh another question, I think that when people have their cars lisence they only need to do their practical r-e test and they get their full lisence right?
In my case im probably going to end up doing my bikes first, so does it work vice versa? probably not ay.. but worth the try.
So i think it would be wiser to just get my cars, and then just do the bikes aye?
In your case, you'd have to get P plates as well. I don't know what you mean by full licence straight away, but if you mean you get your R class (250cc+) licence then the answer is no, you are still limited to 250cc. If you mean when you get your full car licence after you've passed the P-plater period, I'd say yes, that's probably the case*.
I got my car licence first, then my R-E licence. I am currently licenced to drive anything that qualifies as a normal car and a motorcycle up to 250cc in displacement. I cannot legally, for example, ride a Kawasaki Z750.
I'm not sure how the new system of L/P plates work if you're using both a car and a motorbike to do your hours; you should call the DPI regarding this. I went under the old system for my P's and because I was on a non-probationary licence by the time I got my bike licence, I never had to display P plates.

Regarding getting your car licence then your bike, I would say yes, that is probably wiser. You're more likely to have an accident as an inexperienced driver/rider, and at the very least you have crumple zones in a car. That is not to say that you WILL have an accident; it's just to say that if you do you'll have a lower chance of being injured. Consider it risk management. That being said, you're posting on a forum of riders - we choose to ride not because it is safer, but because we love doing it.

*Call the DPI on 13-11-56 to double check anything you may think is wrong. I'm not DPI trained staff (and I wonder sometimes if even they know what's going on) so the information I wrote here may be inaccurate.

EDIT: Lessons are typically around $60 each, regardless of whether you use their bike or yours, and you need to book for 2 hours on the day of your test - one hour before and one hour to do the test (because the instructor has to wait around for you to finish your test in case you fail). Just food for thought.

[Xuaxace]

Wow Thanks for the awesome right up trenchi
Definitely cleared up some holes.

Kinda sucks to have a shadow.. dont really know anyone and i was just going to do like my friends used to do in spain, (pick it up and ride without lisence)
I wasnt obiously going to go throught leach or the freeway but i pretty much cant even go to the park near my house aye, well maybe if i push the bike there... lol.

Well regarding the leassons, shit im broke as, must save a bit and my parents wont help me out bloody bike haters !

But yeah for what ive learned by myself , I can do O turns + hillstart + Emergency + Have a good stability and low speeds.


I hopefully will try to book a leasson or so by 2 weeks time, i gotta get my fairings fix and im having some weird shit problem with the indicators, when i pull it to the left i almost never works, i gota maintain it for like half a sec for it to work and sometimes it just flashes while im holding the indicator lever then when i stop it doesnt maintain, i think i might have to go to the mechanic?
Ah Sucks i really have no money

I will call dpi to see how compatible the Cars lisence and bike lisence is, hopefully i can save myself 25 hours of bike logbook.

Oh i got another question, Once i get my R+E lisence, im just going to go to the Phase to L's because im not 17 yet right? so im pretty much going to be As capped as before i do the test?


Thanks again for the right up trenchi
by the way, nice time to be on psb

[stalker]

If cops catch you, they will rape you.

And the big fine you get will mean you;ll be paying that off instead of getting lessons.

[Tenchi]

No problems. It's my only hope that we lose as few riders as possible.

You can always check out the shadow thread, and request one for some riding. Get 2 of them and you can go out twice a week, for one hour or so.

Regarding bike repairs, don't bother fixing the fairings unless they're interfering with your riding. Try pulling the indicators apart, cleaning them and putting them back on. Be prepared to replace them if you do this. Also double check you're not pushing them in as you move them over as the ZZR has a push button indicator cancellation. Make sure you check out motorbike wreckers - indicators on the handlebars hardly ever get damaged in crashes so you may be able to source one in mint condition for cheap.

Regarding lessons, save your money up until you have enough to take all your lessons in a row. The last thing you want to do is take lessons, run out of money, then when you have your test be rusty on all of your learning.

Oh i got another question, Once i get my R+E lisence, im just going to go to the Phase to L's because im not 17 yet right? so im pretty much going to be As capped as before i do the test?
As far as I know, the answer to both questions is yes. However, this is something you'll have to confirm with the DPI.

by the way, nice time to be on psb
Yeah, can't sleep

[Xuaxace]

No problems. It's my only hope that we lose as few riders as possible.

what does that meant to mean!

Nah i like the bike naked but the fairings hold the front indicators that i had to take off, That isnt really a problem. i cant reatach them but i gotta fix the fairings to place them in. And regarding the indicators... its shorta of a electrical problem or something to do wif the level, it goes fine to the right and weird like it isnt always making conection when going to the left so a lot of times the indicator doesnt come out when pulling it to the left, its a big F"·!Ing pain in the ass as well as not very save.

Hopefully if i get this problem fixed i get someone to shadow me around, not before tho i think it would piss off anyone to have a leaner with bloody broken indicators


i couldnt sleep either

[rover]

You only need to do phase 2 L's for one class.
If you've got a C class already, you won't need to do phase 2 for R-E.
If you don't have C class, you will need to do phase 2 for R-E.

IIRC, you need to be 17 before you can get your license?
In which case, may be worth getting C class first if you can do the hours in a car easier.

[jak47]

motorbike first you have to do a log book and if at the same time your doing car you have to do a log book for that aswell... im in the same boat as you but i have a scooter licence- i have one month till i can do my practical

[Xuaxace]

motorbike first you have to do a log book and if at the same time your doing car you have to do a log book for that aswell... im in the same boat as you but i have a scooter licence- i have one month till i can do my practical

I really dont wanna do both, well i woulnt mind the 25 hours logbook on the bike to be honest, would have some fun rides.

Im going to try to do my cars Practical in around 2 months so hopefully i can get it over with, not as confident on the car as in the bike but owell,

I was going throught the DPI broacher and there was something that didnt make much sense...

Learning to ride a motorcycle
Once you have your learners permit you can have riding leassons with
* A liseced riding instructor who holds the same or higher class motorcycle lisence which you are applyingfor or

*A person who holds a current drivers lisence and has held for at least four years the class of drivers lisence your a applaying for.

Whats up with the last one?
Is that an error or true?

[Xuaxace]

sent twice

[lobo]

I really dont wanna do both, well i woulnt mind the 25 hours logbook on the bike to be honest, would have some fun rides.

Im going to try to do my cars Practical in around 2 months so hopefully i can get it over with, not as confident on the car as in the bike but owell,

I was going throught the DPI broacher and there was something that didnt make much sense...




Whats up with the last one?
Is that an error or true?

thats what shadows are, we are not "licenced instructors" , but we have held that class of licence for more than four years, for example if someone has held the RE for four years and the R for three years they can legally shadow a RE but not a R learner, i have to agree with Tenchi, do yourself a favour and dont try riding the bike without someone with you because you may get away with it 99 times out of a hundred, but all it takes is that one time to either get pulled over by Mr Plod or hit something and then you better have the K-Y jelly handy because the pineapple is gonna hurt

[Tenchi]

what does that meant to mean!

Nothing personal. There's some sort of statistic for people that survive their first 500 hours, that's all. Something about less likely to die on the road. Gives the higher ups less ammo to fire at bikers.

Whats up with the last one?
Is that an error or true?

A person who holds a current drivers lisence and has held for at least four years the class of drivers lisence your a applaying for.

That's the shadow clause. It means:
The person shadowing you must have a valid licence (as opposed to an expired licence, or one that has been lost due to accumulation of demerit points)
The person shadowing you must have had the class of licence that you are currently going for (R-E) for the duration of no less than 4 years.

For example, my father has had his R class licence for over 20 years. That means he has also held his R-E class licence for over 20 years. He holds a current licence as according to the DPI and therefore is a valid shadow.

I hold a valid licence with the DPI. I have had my R-E class licence for 8 months or so. As 8 months is less than 4 years, it means I cannot legally shadow you.

I hope this clears things up.

[Xuaxace]

Nothing personal. There's some sort of statistic for people that survive their first 500 hours, that's all. Something about less likely to die on the road. Gives the higher ups less ammo to fire at bikers.

.

Lol, well yeah ive always been passionate about bikes so even if i crash and fuck my body badly i will get back to it if im not dead.
But If by some short I've given the impresion im reckless , im not.


Yea i thought that refered to the shadow system but why does it say drivers instead of riders?
That kInda confused me a little.

[esquire]

motorbike first you have to do a log book and if at the same time your doing car you have to do a log book for that aswell...

Not quite. You only ever have to do one log book. Bike and car go in the same one.

I was already on phase 2 L's for a car when I passed my R-E practical. Then I just rode with a shadow a few times and got the rest of my hours done.

Just try get both phase 2s at the same time.

[Tenchi]

Yea i thought that refered to the shadow system but why does it say drivers instead of riders?
That kInda confused me a little.

It also applies to C class licence holders, who are teaching L plate drivers in manual/automatic cars in place of an instructor. This allows your mother or father to teach you, as opposed to having to do all your lessons through an instructor. As such, it states "driver" instead of rider.

[g0zer]

sneaking out to do little practicing on your own is kind of on the low end of breaking the rules. just be careful, dont crash and dont get caught.

ride around your burb when traffic is light, roll into a few quiet culdesacs and do some wobbly figure 8's then move on before some fruit cake gets annoyed you will be fine.

[Xuaxace]

It also applies to C class licence holders, who are teaching L plate drivers in manual/automatic cars in place of an instructor. This allows your mother or father to teach you, as opposed to having to do all your lessons through an instructor. As such, it states "driver" instead of rider.

Oh... i see, ye my dad teaches me to drive and etc, they kinda made it confusing writing that in the motorcycle article tho. but owell.


But anyway, im not going to go on public roads like i wanted, just gonna go to the park nearby and do my practice while no one is there, i dont think that should be ilegal really..

[alpha]

Hey Xuaxace.. I was in the same shoe. Mates didn't ride and I just pm a member who lived near me and asked if he was willing to shadow me on a few rides. Coincedentally , my shadows lives a street above me and has taken me on a few rides.

[Xuaxace]

Hey Xuaxace.. I was in the same shoe. Mates didn't ride and I just pm a member who lived near me and asked if he was willing to shadow me on a few rides. Coincedentally , my shadows lives a street above me and has taken me on a few rides.

Wow thats pretty lucky!
I will see if there is someone nearby kardinya who would like to help me out here!
I just got my bike fully fixed today, ( fixed fairings and the indicators etc) so now its fully road worthy... pretty exited!

If anyone can shadow me a bit please pm me! i will fully apreciate anything

[cYcLoNe]

and when you travel in the car start doing head checks - it will help you ease into road riding because you will be doing head checks at every street for your test.

UMMMMMM HELLO? It's that whole "just do it for your test" crap that gets people into
trouble in the first place. If you want to live, you will ALWAYS check.

Make sure you check out motorbike wreckers - indicators on the handlebars hardly ever get damaged in crashes so you may be able to source one in mint condition for cheap

Last trip to "Two Wheels" quoted $90 for the whole switchblock, $30 just for the switch.