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Thread: unreliable bikes from major brands

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    Member wheel_of_steell's Avatar
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    unreliable bikes from major brands

    How does is come to be that established, long running brands can make major lemon models? I'm not picking on any brand in particular. Sure, you'd expect a tiny company like Zero or Ural to have extremely limited resources and experience in fine tuning mass manufactured products. But I'm wondering about the big guys making flawed or totally bad machines.

    Say for example, the yamaha fz6s. Very high quality bike that's obviously spent a lot of time in R&D. But the frames are known to crack. Yamaha has been making alloy frames for decades, and their engineers weren't born yesterday. There would have been hundreds of prototypes on shaker rigs and accelerated wear circuits. They're not generally known for making bad quality bikes or having a shit company culture. How does stuff like that slip through the cracks?
    Quote Originally Posted by devolved
    I just crashed into a schoolbus full of kiddies, killed them all, raped them, set them on fire and now I'm pissing on their charred remains.

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    Member Ryanoceros's Avatar
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    Honda with the fire blade. Oh wait, they’ve always been shit
    Rest in Peace

    #294

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    Member Hillz's Avatar
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    KTM....
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    when building things to a budget corners are cut.

    if budget is cut halfway through r+d things are missed and more corners cut.

    basically making somthing as cheap as possible to earn maximum profit per unit sold.
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    little end bearing. best describes as the sound of 'A little black man with a hammer in your engine'. big end sounds like a bigger black man...

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    So a cracked frame slipped through the cracks?

    These threads crack me up.


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    Member Water pig's Avatar
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    As long as the brand isn't Japanese, it's expected and adds to the ownership experience, Hillz hit the nail on the head naming ktm for rushing brain farts of ideas into production and worrying about failure later using the customer as the test pilots

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    Quote Originally Posted by wheel_of_steell View Post
    How does is come to be that established, long running brands can make major lemon models? I'm not picking on any brand in particular. Sure, you'd expect a tiny company like Zero or Ural to have extremely limited resources and experience in fine tuning mass manufactured products. But I'm wondering about the big guys making flawed or totally bad machines.

    Say for example, the yamaha fz6s. Very high quality bike that's obviously spent a lot of time in R&D. But the frames are known to crack. Yamaha has been making alloy frames for decades, and their engineers weren't born yesterday. There would have been hundreds of prototypes on shaker rigs and accelerated wear circuits. They're not generally known for making bad quality bikes or having a shit company culture. How does stuff like that slip through the cracks?
    From a quick search on fazer frame problems, it seems most that have are considered to be used "outside of design envelope". Basically, you buy a cheap commuter bike and yolo the fuck out of it because, well, they actually go ok, don't expect components to last. GSXR frame cracking, zx10 headshake, killer tls power delivery, I could go on. Not saying I disagree with ya at all, but sometimes looking beyond internet sensationalism is needed. Conversely, a boring underdone bike like Suzukis' SV/DL/GSF 650has proved to be sooo much more than the sum of its' parts, to the point the bikes were used as a starting point for a whole racing series throughout Europe. I have seen these things treated, both on road and off, like motocross bikes, race replicas and learner fodder, probably ram raid tools too.

    TL/DR: sometimes manufacturers merely meet expectation, which gets exceeded by consumers, sometimes they over-engineer to the point of brilliance/stupidity and consumers never get close or they are used outside the original intended use. buyer beware. And stop trying to make bikes not suitable for a purpose, suitable

    Wonder how that 40hp grom is doing
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    Member datsikk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wheel_of_steell View Post
    Say for example, the yamaha fz6s. Very high quality bike that's obviously spent a lot of time in R&D. But the frames are known to crack. Yamaha has been making alloy frames for decades, and their engineers weren't born yesterday. There would have been hundreds of prototypes on shaker rigs and accelerated wear circuits. They're not generally known for making bad quality bikes or having a shit company culture. How does stuff like that slip through the cracks?
    Its possible that a design was agreed to, the parts tested but then the bean counters came along and demanded changes. So "small" changes were made but then the frame was not retested. Voila, cracked frames!

    Maybe something as simple as the rubber used to isolate vibrations was changed (if its used anywhere? I can only think of the cush rubber) changing that would might change the natural frequency/amplitude of cyclic stress of a part.

    changing that may reduce the number of stress cycles the frame can withstand.
    Likes thro, wheel_of_steell liked this post

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    Honda mvx 250 what a disappointment 3 cyc 250 2stroke .....
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    Engineering is a trade off.

    Sometimes the trade-off is not tested enough, not enough leeway is left for manufacturing process tolerances, etc.

    It happens. You push the boundaries (be it cost, performance, etc.) sometimes you overstep them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryanoceros View Post
    Honda with the fire blade. Oh wait, they’ve always been shit
    There's youthful ignorance, and then there's Ryanoceros
    “Crashing is shit for you, shit for the bike, shit for the mechanics and shit for the set-up,” Checa told me a while back. “It’s a signal that you are heading in the wrong direction. You want to win but crashing is the opposite. It’s like being in France when you want to go to England and when you crash you go to Spain. That way you’ll never get to England!” -- Carlos Checa
    Likes Shakey, Thomas Peel, DQ, Para045, Tim the PM and 1 others liked this post

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    Quote Originally Posted by thro View Post
    Engineering is a trade off.

    Sometimes the trade-off is not tested enough, not enough leeway is left for manufacturing process tolerances, etc.

    It happens. You push the boundaries (be it cost, performance, etc.) sometimes you overstep them.



    There's youthful ignorance, and then there's Ryanoceros
    There’s being an arrogant keyboard warrior, and then there’s thro

    Edit: surprised you didn’t block me on PSB for making you cry, like you did on Facebook. Or did your mum take you to a class on how to cope with reality like an adult ?
    Rest in Peace

    #294

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    There is also the open secret called "designed/planned obsolescense". Products are designed with specific faults so they don't last forever and the customer has to buy something new. Designing the "life expectancy" of a product is one of the key factors in product development these days.

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    Member Ryanoceros's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hillz View Post
    KTM....
    I must’ve got a good one..
    Rest in Peace

    #294

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryanoceros View Post
    I must’ve got a good one..
    Or don't have the skills to push it past its design limitations
    #1 Gold Ticket Holder for the Barfridge Fan Club
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    Noted. We'll check back on that one in three years
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    Anything with this badge on it;



    /thread
    Trying to think of a wise and sincere signature quote, but the only words that leap to mind are, "TITTY SPRINKLES"
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  16. #16
    Member Ryanoceros's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Para045 View Post
    Or don't have the skills to push it past its design limitations
    I've entered 0 enduro events on it, so that's true. It's one of those bikes that's over-engineered
    Rest in Peace

    #294

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryanoceros View Post
    There’s being an arrogant keyboard warrior, and then there’s thro

    Edit: surprised you didn’t block me on PSB for making you cry, like you did on Facebook. Or did your mum take you to a class on how to cope with reality like an adult ?
    Lol

    I blocked you on Facebook because you’re a vapid fuckwit, and the world is dumber for your existence. Sounds like you’re the one with a bee in your bonnet about it.

    You’ve been a complete dumb cunt since you were on your re and you’re a total dumb cunt now 😂

  18. #18
    Member Ryanoceros's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thro View Post
    Lol

    I blocked you on Facebook because you’re a vapid fuckwit, and the world is dumber for your existence. Sounds like you’re the one with a bee in your bonnet about it.
    I don’t really care champ, I have enough overweight computer nerds on my friends list that losing one isn’t a big deal.

    Ah damn, you got me there. Fuck. Now everyone knows I’m dumb. My life is over. How do I block people that hurt my feelings ?
    Rest in Peace

    #294

  19. #19
    Member thro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryanoceros View Post
    I don’t really care champ, I have enough overweight computer nerds on my friends list that losing one isn’t a big deal
    And yet you’re still crying about it 2 years later

    😂😂😂
    “Crashing is shit for you, shit for the bike, shit for the mechanics and shit for the set-up,” Checa told me a while back. “It’s a signal that you are heading in the wrong direction. You want to win but crashing is the opposite. It’s like being in France when you want to go to England and when you crash you go to Spain. That way you’ll never get to England!” -- Carlos Checa
    Likes Para045 liked this post

  20. #20
    Member Ryanoceros's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thro View Post
    And yet you’re still crying about it 2 years later

    😂😂😂
    Has it really been that long since you did your best anchor impression on a social ride ? My my, I guess if I was smart enough (or I stayed at home as often as you) I would've remembered.
    Rest in Peace

    #294

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