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    Looks like a solid build. I Definitely support running your o/s on an ssd, it makes boot up time seem instantaneous.

    I notice you are running win7 pro 32bit currently. Consider going with a 64bit o/s if you intend to run 16gb of ram.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cone Cat View Post
    As previously suggested, don't bother with AMD anymore.

    For the motherboard, I avoid the real cheapies, reliability is a problem with them. Mobo's are good around the $120 mark such as;
    https://www.ple.com.au/Products/6266...TX-Motherboard

    Hmm will have to start doing some more research

    I prefer ASUS or Gigabyte. I've had problems with ASROCK in the past. Just not worth it to save a few bucks.
    MSI boards I hear are good, and I've had no problems with their video cards, but I have little experience with MSI mobo's.

    Can't say I'd ever heard of Asrock before and a little Googling suggested they were a cheaper MB made by Asus and had some issues

    CPU, The intel Kabylake i7100 will be plenty for what your planning to do with it.
    https://www.ple.com.au/Products/6268...3MB-Retail-Box

    OK so both the MB and CPU are actually lower spec than what I was looking at, I was going overboard for the intended use?

    If you want a bit more grunt/future proof, go up to the i5
    https://www.ple.com.au/Products/6265...6MB-Retail-Box

    Seems to be similar to the Ryzen in performance

    I'd definitely suggest going the SSD for the boot drive.
    You can't beat the Samsung 850 series SSD's. Very reliable.
    https://www.ple.com.au/Products/6172...-7mm-250GB-SSD

    Yeah the more I look that sounds like an improvement, the only thing is generally our PC runs 24/7, as such will an SSD be an advantage then?

    If you need a dinosaur spinner, brand and size can mean a big difference with reliability. If you ask the geeks on whirlpool about HD reliability, they will/should point you to;
    https://www.backblaze.com/blog/hard-...stats-q1-2016/

    Definately want a large HDD as we store a lot of stuff on the PC like documents/pictures & home movies that my missus does her geneology with Interesting looking at that there is a big variance in what brands have failed in what types ie The same brand in one size has a much higher failure rate than a similar drive with a different capacity

    PSU, Corsair is a good brand to go buy. Modular means that you can plug/unplug the cable groups so you just plug in the groups you need, less clutter than a non modular supply.
    If you want to spring for a really good power supply, then go up to the RM series.
    https://www.ple.com.au/Products/6214...r-Power-Supply

    Yeah was doing a bit of reading about the RMx versions today, an improved variant of the RM

    750 watts is for systems where the video card is bigger than the motherboard. 500 watts for systems where the video card is smaller than the motherboard. :-) Having the extra power can't hurt and can actually mean you use less power, but my experience with PSU's is to go for quality first over more power.

    Not sure in what way you mean "bigger", in my OP is the VC bigger than the MB or smaller?

    Number one reason I end up building a new PC for a customer is PSU failure. Sometimes they are lucky and I can just replace the el cheapo PSU, usually though it damages the motherboard and that means a new system.

    I'd pick the CM550 over the CX750 any day. Personally I use the AX series, and usually fit HX or RM series to customers for gaming rigs depending on budget. I never go below CM series quality equivilant.

    If you want to go with a better CPU cooler, this one is a good upgrade on stock and better made and will last longer than the Hyper 212. I usually buy CPU's without the retail box/cooling fan and add this fan instead.
    https://www.ple.com.au/Products/6202...151-CPU-Cooler

    Number two reason for building a new customer a PC is CPU cooling fan failure.
    Video card cooling fans fail as well, but that just means a new video card.
    Hmm Dr V above reckons I don't really need a CPU cooler


    Quote Originally Posted by MoistCat View Post
    Going overboard with PSU will be good for future proofing, get a full modular one which makes cable management easier to do. A good quality PSU would be likely to out live all the rest of the hardware in the PC. In the last 8-9 years I've had two PSUs, and only got the 2nd one as my current PC has the first completely new everything system for myself.
    Think I have either a 750watt or 850watt powering 6 data storage drives, and 2x Nvidia GTX 980s.


    +1 for MSY, good on prices.
    The last 2 PC's we've had built haven't had any real issues apart from the current one having RAID go out of synch and a couple of HDD's fail, just started having issues playing newer games with better graphics etc


    Quote Originally Posted by Downunder View Post
    Looks like a solid build. I Definitely support running your o/s on an ssd, it makes boot up time seem instantaneous.

    I notice you are running win7 pro 32bit currently. Consider going with a 64bit o/s if you intend to run 16gb of ram.
    As above the more I look that sounds like an improvement, the only thing is generally our PC runs 24/7, as such will an SSD be an advantage then? Also the specs at the top were a cut and past from when it was built, about a year and a half ago we had some problems with viruses and a HDD failure so the missus's BiL repaired it

    He also put 2TB HDD's in instead of the 2 500GB and upgraded it from W32 bit to 64bit and then about a year ago I put in an extra stick of RAM to go from 4>8Gb and also a GT730 graphics card to help run my boys games as the onboard graphics were only DirectX 10 and they needed DX11

    I'll definately be going the 64bit route, not sure whether to go W10 or stay with W7 Pro
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phildo View Post
    Noted. We'll check back on that one in three years
    Quote Originally Posted by filbert View Post
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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Para045 View Post
    Hmm Dr V above reckons I don't really need a CPU cooler




    The last 2 PC's we've had built haven't had any real issues apart from the current one having RAID go out of synch and a couple of HDD's fail, just started having issues playing newer games with better graphics etc




    As above the more I look that sounds like an improvement, the only thing is generally our PC runs 24/7, as such will an SSD be an advantage then? Also the specs at the top were a cut and past from when it was built, about a year and a half ago we had some problems with viruses and a HDD failure so the missus's BiL repaired it

    He also put 2TB HDD's in instead of the 2 500GB and upgraded it from W32 bit to 64bit and then about a year ago I put in an extra stick of RAM to go from 4>8Gb and also a GT730 graphics card to help run my boys games as the onboard graphics were only DirectX 10 and they needed DX11

    I'll definately be going the 64bit route, not sure whether to go W10 or stay with W7 Pro
    There is a lot of people that dislike windows 10, I think it is great and a good upgrade from win7 speed and features wise. No one wanted to leave windows XP either but i think windows 10 is a good upgrade

    Sent from my SM-A700K using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by Para045 View Post
    Hmm Dr V above reckons I don't really need a CPU cooler




    The last 2 PC's we've had built haven't had any real issues apart from the current one having RAID go out of synch and a couple of HDD's fail, just started having issues playing newer games with better graphics etc




    As above the more I look that sounds like an improvement, the only thing is generally our PC runs 24/7, as such will an SSD be an advantage then? Also the specs at the top were a cut and past from when it was built, about a year and a half ago we had some problems with viruses and a HDD failure so the missus's BiL repaired it

    He also put 2TB HDD's in instead of the 2 500GB and upgraded it from W32 bit to 64bit and then about a year ago I put in an extra stick of RAM to go from 4>8Gb and also a GT730 graphics card to help run my boys games as the onboard graphics were only DirectX 10 and they needed DX11

    I'll definately be going the 64bit route, not sure whether to go W10 or stay with W7 Pro
    Instead of the Noctua fan you'll be using the one that comes with the CPU.

    SSD's load programs faster than conventional (they're basically flash drives - thing to remember is that if you do a defrag on your drives DON'T tell it to defrag the SSD!!!) HDD's, so putting stuff like Office and games on there makes sense (depending on how many games you put on there), use the other 2 drives for media will work better.
    I'm happier than a tornado in a trailer park!

  5. #25
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    You definitely want an SSD hard drive.

    The first series of SSD's are starting to fail now after about 5 years. But the tech has improved a lot since then. The current generation is expected to last longer than the traditional HDD. Samsung offers a 5 year warranty on the 850 series SSd's, which supports the higher life span claim.
    TBH though, we won't know for several years how long these SSD's will last.

    Modern OS's such as Windows 10 will literally thrash a HDD to death. The drive will be in near constant high speed transfer mode meaning it will be constantly at high speed and read/writing which means shorter life when you are using the system. Boot up and idle won't be any difference as the system will run from cached data. But when in use, Windows 10 draws data from the primary drive far more than any other OS.

    Honestly, you'd be mad to not put an SSD into a modern computer these days as your primary boot drive. I have an SSD/HDD combo in my system. When I access the HDD, there is a slight delay while it spins up which means that for most of the time, It's sitting there idle while the SSD with no moving parts does all the hard work.

    The reason why I recommend going for a better CPU cooler is for if the cooling fan fails. If you have the standard CPU cooler, you have mere seconds to shut down before your CPU is fried. The bigger heat sink gives you more passive cooling which buys you a few more seconds to shut down if the fan goes.
    I have a Noctua NH-U14s with dual fans mounted onto it. If one fan fails, nothing changes, if both fans fail, well my system will run indefinitely without the cooling fans if I am not playing a game and not overclocking.
    Note that the CPU heatsink still gets passive airflow from the other 9 cooling fans in the case though. The point is that cooling fans can fail. The failure of a $10 part can fry your expensive CPU so a little bit of insurance can be had buy having a cooler with a bigger passive heatsink.

    I well know the infamous Hyper 212 CPU cooler. Yes it's a bargain for the performance and a good idea to go to even this level on a stock system. But check the base plate is truly flat before mounting. The quality control is a bit iffy, they are built to a price after all.

    If you want a damn good air cooler for not much more, the Noctua NH-U9s would be the top end. Noctua's quality is faultless, 6 year warranty, $89 and if the cooling fan failed, you will have plenty of time to shut down your programs, save any projects and shut down before the temps get anywhere near critical. I've fitted several noctua's in my time, 9-15cm and they all impress.
    https://www.pccasegear.com/products/...u9s-cpu-cooler

    I don't like liquid cooling. Too much to fail as in the cooling fan, water pump can fail as well as the dreaded leak. Too many stories of water coolers leaking and spraying liquid everywhere and frying everything. If you buy one, check to see if the warranty covers damage to subsequent components like your CPU, mobo and video card being fried by coolant.

    As far as PSU's go, these modern CPU's, Mobo's and video card all need clean power more than ever before. Too many people look at the wattage only and don't consider the quality of the power.
    Hence why I prefer RM/HX/AX grade PSU's in the corsair range. Not only will they last, but they will also deliver cleaner, stable power. I run the AX760i which is a digital PSU, the best type you can get.
    But keep in mind that my system will overclock the CPU to 4.3ghz as well as overclock the system bus/ram and video card so good clean power is mandatory for my system to run stable at that level. It's overkill for a system that does not overclock.

    Video card being larger than the mobo comment. Well if you have a look at the high end video cards, when installed into a system, they usually overhang the motherboard which is what I meant by being bigger than the mobo.
    Card's such as the GTX1070 and higher usually need extra power from the bigger PSU's and these are the cards that are usually longer than the motherboard is wide and overhang. It's a funny rule of thumb I read somewhere.
    The other one is if you install the video card into the case first and then plug the motherboard into the video card or need a small crane to lift the video card into the case. :-)

    Edit Forgot to mention the CPU.

    Modern OS's such as Windows 8-10 are all about multi core CPU's. The software is optimized to run on multiple cores and that means faster system process than what a faster clock speed will do.
    In other words, if you where choosing between a seven core @ 3.0ghz versus a 5 core @ 3.3ghz for the same price, go with the seven core.
    The problem is that sort of thinking is redundant with the new kabylake range from intel as the price points = faster processing with the optimized software so the more you pay, the faster your system will go in the real world.

    5 cores is usually enough for most users. it's only high end gamers and data intensive apps and blatant multi tasking that would use the extra cores from the I7's.

    Just don't couple an expensive CPU onto a cheap mobo and basic video card. Weakest link in the chain etc. Keep everything relative. The i5 7400 and 7500 are plenty unless you are going for a good premium/performance mobo and GT1070 or better video card.
    Last edited by Cone Cat; 25-04-2017 at 03:21 PM.

  6. #26
    Member Para045's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTSam View Post
    There is a lot of people that dislike windows 10, I think it is great and a good upgrade from win7 speed and features wise. No one wanted to leave windows XP either but i think windows 10 is a good upgrade
    Yeah I've used W10 for about a year now on this laptop and I do like some of the new features but do get annoyed with some of the little quirks like it slowing down/freezing when an update is due for download


    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Venkman View Post
    Instead of the Noctua fan you'll be using the one that comes with the CPU.

    Ah OK

    SSD's load programs faster than conventional (they're basically flash drives - thing to remember is that if you do a defrag on your drives DON'T tell it to defrag the SSD!!!) HDD's, so putting stuff like Office and games on there makes sense (depending on how many games you put on there), use the other 2 drives for media will work better.
    Don't you need to select each drive separately when you defrag? I do like the idea of an SSD for the OS Wont be many games on there really though
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phildo View Post
    Noted. We'll check back on that one in three years
    Quote Originally Posted by filbert View Post
    i'll pretend you didn't know she was 13

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    windows 7 will reach end of life in Jan 2020...no more updates.

    For the money you're spending, windows 10 is really the only option.

  8. #28
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    If its for any real gaming i'd ditch the 1050 and step to a 1060 6 GB or RX480/RX580 (new card) 8 GB as a priority.

    The weak point in that build is most definitely the 1050, you'll notice a massive difference stepping up to a 1060 or RX480/580 for (or even a 4 GB RX470 - though i'd try to stretch for a 1060 6 GB or RXx80 8 G vs. the total system build cost) not a huge additional spend. Certainly not in terms of bang for buck. Moving forward, 2-4 GB of video memory will be an issue for upcoming titles. VRAM size doesn't make much difference until you run out of it, then performance tanks badly.

    The stock Ryzen cooler (on a non-X SKU) will be fine, however I'd forego the 1500X and step to a 1600 for the additional 2 cores that will be more useful in coming years. Or drop to a 1500 (non-X) and just overclock it to 1500X speed - in fact, all of the X series Ryzens are pretty irrelevant for the most part. Just buy non-X, get a free cooler that's good enough, and run X series clock speeds on it.

    But even if you aren't overclocking... i'd ditch the 1500X (which IIRC doesn't ship with a cooler), step to a 1600 with a free AMD cooler and 2 extra cores. Will be roughly the same money and much better for upcoming software.

    Personally i would not bother with liquid cooling in that build. For gaming, the big advantage of liquid cooling will be if you cool the video card, and that gets real expensive real quick, so water cooling a low end video card isn't worth it. CPU - don't bother unless you're benchmarking or buying the highest spec CPU and it still isn't enough.

    2c.
    Last edited by thro; 25-04-2017 at 07:59 PM.
    Crashing is shit for you, shit for the bike, shit for the mechanics and shit for the set-up, Checa told me a while back. Its a signal that you are heading in the wrong direction. You want to win but crashing is the opposite. Its like being in France when you want to go to England and when you crash you go to Spain. That way youll never get to England! -- Carlos Checa
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    In terms of intel vs. AMD... Ryzen is good, and the 1600 makes anything below the higher end i7s in intel's lineup irrelevant.

    You're talking 12 threads (on an R5 1600 or 1600X) vs. 4 for an i5. It's not even a comparison. Be aware that there are memory support issues with Ryzen for > 2400 mhz DDR4 at the moment, which will be fixed with BIOS updates once the motherboard manufacturers figure their shit out. Apparently the BIOS release was rushed a bit, it's not a hardware issue. If you're running ddr4 2400 then no problem. Last i heard 2933 is also working just fine without faffing about. Essentially the memory timings for faster memory speeds aren't right in the early BIOS revisions. This means you can install the memory and it will work just fine, but if you're trying to run your faster-rated memory faster than the standard DDR4 speed the BIOS may need updates first.

    I'm partial to gigabyte boards myself.


    edit:
    My home desktop is currently an intel Xeon E3-1231v3, and I've been intel for the past 10-15 years, so I'm not some die hard AMD fanboy here

    But if i was to build a new rig for myself right now it would be an R7 1700...
    Last edited by thro; 25-04-2017 at 10:26 PM.
    Crashing is shit for you, shit for the bike, shit for the mechanics and shit for the set-up, Checa told me a while back. Its a signal that you are heading in the wrong direction. You want to win but crashing is the opposite. Its like being in France when you want to go to England and when you crash you go to Spain. That way youll never get to England! -- Carlos Checa

  10. #30
    Member Para045's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cone Cat View Post
    You definitely want an SSD hard drive.

    The first series of SSD's are starting to fail now after about 5 years. But the tech has improved a lot since then. The current generation is expected to last longer than the traditional HDD. Samsung offers a 5 year warranty on the 850 series SSd's, which supports the higher life span claim.
    TBH though, we won't know for several years how long these SSD's will last.

    Modern OS's such as Windows 10 will literally thrash a HDD to death. The drive will be in near constant high speed transfer mode meaning it will be constantly at high speed and read/writing which means shorter life when you are using the system. Boot up and idle won't be any difference as the system will run from cached data. But when in use, Windows 10 draws data from the primary drive far more than any other OS.

    Honestly, you'd be mad to not put an SSD into a modern computer these days as your primary boot drive. I have an SSD/HDD combo in my system. When I access the HDD, there is a slight delay while it spins up which means that for most of the time, It's sitting there idle while the SSD with no moving parts does all the hard work.


    I assume you are talking about these SSD's >Samsung 850 EVO 250GB SSD as opposed to the M.2 ones like these? >Corsair Force Series MP500 120GB NVMe M.2 SSD

    What are your thoughts on these > Seagate FireCuda Hybrid SSD/HDD's? Worth the extra over a std HDD or not?

    The reason why I recommend going for a better CPU cooler is for if the cooling fan fails. If you have the standard CPU cooler, you have mere seconds to shut down before your CPU is fried. The bigger heat sink gives you more passive cooling which buys you a few more seconds to shut down if the fan goes.
    I have a Noctua NH-U14s with dual fans mounted onto it. If one fan fails, nothing changes, if both fans fail, well my system will run indefinitely without the cooling fans if I am not playing a game and not overclocking.
    Note that the CPU heatsink still gets passive airflow from the other 9 cooling fans in the case though. The point is that cooling fans can fail. The failure of a $10 part can fry your expensive CPU so a little bit of insurance can be had buy having a cooler with a bigger passive heatsink.

    Ok I get ya

    I well know the infamous Hyper 212 CPU cooler. Yes it's a bargain for the performance and a good idea to go to even this level on a stock system. But check the base plate is truly flat before mounting. The quality control is a bit iffy, they are built to a price after all.

    If you want a damn good air cooler for not much more, the Noctua NH-U9s would be the top end. Noctua's quality is faultless, 6 year warranty, $89 and if the cooling fan failed, you will have plenty of time to shut down your programs, save any projects and shut down before the temps get anywhere near critical. I've fitted several noctua's in my time, 9-15cm and they all impress.
    https://www.pccasegear.com/products/...u9s-cpu-cooler

    How does the U12s compare as that's the same price?

    I don't like liquid cooling. Too much to fail as in the cooling fan, water pump can fail as well as the dreaded leak. Too many stories of water coolers leaking and spraying liquid everywhere and frying everything. If you buy one, check to see if the warranty covers damage to subsequent components like your CPU, mobo and video card being fried by coolant.

    Yeah that was the 1st thing I thought of when I heard of LC

    As far as PSU's go, these modern CPU's, Mobo's and video card all need clean power more than ever before. Too many people look at the wattage only and don't consider the quality of the power.
    Hence why I prefer RM/HX/AX grade PSU's in the corsair range. Not only will they last, but they will also deliver cleaner, stable power. I run the AX760i which is a digital PSU, the best type you can get.
    But keep in mind that my system will overclock the CPU to 4.3ghz as well as overclock the system bus/ram and video card so good clean power is mandatory for my system to run stable at that level. It's overkill for a system that does not overclock.

    OK

    Video card being larger than the mobo comment. Well if you have a look at the high end video cards, when installed into a system, they usually overhang the motherboard which is what I meant by being bigger than the mobo.
    Card's such as the GTX1070 and higher usually need extra power from the bigger PSU's and these are the cards that are usually longer than the motherboard is wide and overhang. It's a funny rule of thumb I read somewhere.
    The other one is if you install the video card into the case first and then plug the motherboard into the video card or need a small crane to lift the video card into the case. :-)

    Edit Forgot to mention the CPU.

    Modern OS's such as Windows 8-10 are all about multi core CPU's. The software is optimized to run on multiple cores and that means faster system process than what a faster clock speed will do.
    In other words, if you where choosing between a seven core @ 3.0ghz versus a 5 core @ 3.3ghz for the same price, go with the seven core.
    The problem is that sort of thinking is redundant with the new kabylake range from intel as the price points = faster processing with the optimized software so the more you pay, the faster your system will go in the real world.

    5 cores is usually enough for most users. it's only high end gamers and data intensive apps and blatant multi tasking that would use the extra cores from the I7's.

    Just don't couple an expensive CPU onto a cheap mobo and basic video card. Weakest link in the chain etc. Keep everything relative. The i5 7400 and 7500 are plenty unless you are going for a good premium/performance mobo and GT1070 or better video card.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blazon View Post
    windows 7 will reach end of life in Jan 2020...no more updates.

    For the money you're spending, windows 10 is really the only option.
    Hmm OK didn't know that, looks like W10 may be it then


    Quote Originally Posted by thro View Post
    If its for any real gaming i'd ditch the 1050 and step to a 1060 6 GB or RX480/RX580 (new card) 8 GB as a priority.

    The weak point in that build is most definitely the 1050, you'll notice a massive difference stepping up to a 1060 or RX480/580 for (or even a 4 GB RX470 - though i'd try to stretch for a 1060 6 GB or RXx80 8 G vs. the total system build cost) not a huge additional spend. Certainly not in terms of bang for buck. Moving forward, 2-4 GB of video memory will be an issue for upcoming titles. VRAM size doesn't make much difference until you run out of it, then performance tanks badly.

    I guess it comes down to what you mean by "serious gaming"? As I said earlier I don't really play games and my boy only gets on every so often and plays Alien Isolation, Dota2, StarCraft, Heroes of the Storm or Walking Dead, usually he's on his X-Box 1 playing FIFA, GTA V, another version of Walking Dead or a couple of other medium level ones No COD/Halo/Assassins Creed or anything like that, it's primarily going to be for work not as a full on gaming computer Just looking at PCCG even the cheapest 1060 is a huge jump in price compared to the 1050


    The stock Ryzen cooler (on a non-X SKU) will be fine, however I'd forego the 1500X and step to a 1600 for the additional 2 cores that will be more useful in coming years. Or drop to a 1500 (non-X) and just overclock it to 1500X speed - in fact, all of the X series Ryzens are pretty irrelevant for the most part. Just buy non-X, get a free cooler that's good enough, and run X series clock speeds on it.

    What about this then? > AMD Ryzen 5 1600 6 Core 12 Thread CPU, 3.2GHz Base Clock, 3.6GHz Boost, 65W TDP, 16MB L3 cache using the AM4 Socket. Includes AMD Wraith Spire cooler? It was $319 when I originally did the list but is now $299

    But even if you aren't overclocking... i'd ditch the 1500X (which IIRC doesn't ship with a cooler), step to a 1600 with a free AMD cooler and 2 extra cores. Will be roughly the same money and much better for upcoming software.

    Definitely aren't looking at OC, wouldn't even know how to go about it

    Personally i would not bother with liquid cooling in that build. For gaming, the big advantage of liquid cooling will be if you cool the video card, and that gets real expensive real quick, so water cooling a low end video card isn't worth it. CPU - don't bother unless you're benchmarking or buying the highest spec CPU and it still isn't enough.

    2c.
    OK, as I mentioned earlier I only thought about LC as every gaming rig I'd seen specs for recently seemed to have it or mention getting it


    Quote Originally Posted by thro View Post
    In terms of intel vs. AMD... Ryzen is good, and the 1600 makes anything below the higher end i7s in intel's lineup irrelevant.

    You're talking 12 threads (on an R5 1600 or 1600X) vs. 4 for an i5. It's not even a comparison. Be aware that there are memory support issues with Ryzen for > 2400 mhz DDR4 at the moment, which will be fixed with BIOS updates once the motherboard manufacturers figure their shit out. Apparently the BIOS release was rushed a bit, it's not a hardware issue. If you're running ddr4 2400 then no problem. Last i heard 2933 is also working just fine without faffing about. Essentially the memory timings for faster memory speeds aren't right in the early BIOS revisions. This means you can install the memory and it will work just fine, but if you're trying to run your faster-rated memory faster than the standard DDR4 speed the BIOS may need updates first.

    I did actually read something about that on one link I read and a few said they were running 2666MHz no issues

    I'm partial to gigabyte boards myself.

    The missus's BiL that built our last 2 computers mentioned he had a preference for them as well hence why I looked at them as I wouldn't know one from the other anyway, the last 2 had MSI MB's

    edit:
    My home desktop is currently an intel Xeon E3-1231v3, and I've been intel for the past 10-15 years, so I'm not some die hard AMD fanboy here

    But if i was to build a new rig for myself right now it would be an R7 1700...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phildo View Post
    Noted. We'll check back on that one in three years
    Quote Originally Posted by filbert View Post
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  11. #31
    Member thro's Avatar
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    By "gaming" I mean at console quality graphics or better.

    A 1050 is a fairly weak card not really aimed at games. Yes a 1060 (or rx470/480/580 on amd side) is more expensive, but if you're building a gaming box today it is what I would consider the entry level. Otherwise you may as well just stick to consoles; you're just throwing a lot of money at the rest of the pc hardware only to literally halve (or less) your performance. Especially when games start making more use of 4-8 GB of VRAM in the coming years.

    If you want this thing to run games I'd even drop the CPU further in favour of stepping up the video card.

    The "gaming" pc builds you've probably seen with liquid cooling are either just aimed at bling factor or are running higher end components or overclocking most likely. At the component spec you're dealing with the stock CPU cooler will be fine.

    And yeah that ryzen 5 1600 is a good buy right now. Much better than anything in the Intel lineup below the i7. And for anything other than gaming will likely smash anything you can put in an Intel socket 1151 board.
    Crashing is shit for you, shit for the bike, shit for the mechanics and shit for the set-up, Checa told me a while back. Its a signal that you are heading in the wrong direction. You want to win but crashing is the opposite. Its like being in France when you want to go to England and when you crash you go to Spain. That way youll never get to England! -- Carlos Checa

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    Future proofing in the tech world doesn't really work when it's outdated in a year and a dinosaur in 5.

    For what your using it for and majority of the population a 2011 spec pc lots of ram with a ssd would be fine.
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    What are your thoughts on these > Seagate FireCuda Hybrid SSD/HDD's? Worth the extra over a std HDD or not?
    Hybrid drives are a nice idea, but don't really work with Win 10. They are ok with Win 7 & even 8, but the problem with Win 10 is that it will overwhelm the flash part of the drive regularly and still end up thrashing the HDD for the extra data it needs.
    The idea of having an SSD is to run the OS entirely from the SSD for all of it's boot, operations, processing, data updates, caching etc and 8 gigs is not enough for windows 10.


    But even hybrids and a SSD/HDD combo will soon be obsolete as the price of SSD's continue to come down. 1tb Samsung 850 SSD for $475 is almost worth going for over a 250gb SSD and 1TB HDD combo now.

    I assume you are talking about these SSD's >Samsung 850 EVO 250GB SSD as opposed to the M.2 ones like these? >Corsair Force Series MP500 120GB NVMe M.2 SSD
    M2 storage is faster than SSD drives connected via SATA. Having an M2 connector on the mobo is one of the connectivity features that the premium motherboards offer. M2 will cost more given the actual storage is dearer per gigabyte plus you need to buy a motherboard with M2 connection which are usually the premium boards.

    Going M2 over SSD isn't much of an advantage for gaming unless your on the bleeding edge. You'd get a better performance increase by putting that money towards a better CPU or video card. Only if your overclocking the CPU and running at least one high end video card, no point looking at M2/PCI-E storage as a performance boost.


    How does the U12s compare as that's the same price?
    Ohh. Didn't think that the U9S and U12S would be the same price. In that case, bigger is better as long as it will fit inside your case. U9S would fit just about any system including mini and possibly Micro ATX.
    Any standard ATX board will take the bigger U12S up to the U15S coolers.

    Windows 10 sub note.

    There is one thing to consider if your planning on changing to Win 10. It won't be a pleasant experience if your internet download speed is low. Windows 10 needs a lot of big updates and will chew up your bandwidth, The fairly recent v2.6? anniversary update was almost 3 gigs of data if my memory serves. My wife's win 10 laptop is constantly sitting in the corner for hours at a time while it's chewing on updates and I've got a 15.5 megabit per sec download connection. If you have 6 megabit per sec or lower, it's going to be painful.

    Some people are sitting out of win 10 for this reason alone. I've got one customer with 3 computers all sharing a 3.5megabit per second internet connection. They are sitting on win 7 until they get NBN rollout in their area, due July 2019.
    Last edited by Cone Cat; 27-04-2017 at 02:34 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cone Cat View Post
    Hybrid drives are a nice idea, but don't really work with Win 10. They are ok with Win 7 & even 8, but the problem with Win 10 is that it will overwhelm the flash part of the drive regularly and still end up thrashing the HDD for the extra data it needs.
    The idea of having an SSD is to run the OS entirely from the SSD for all of it's boot, operations, processing, data updates, caching etc and 8 gigs is not enough for windows 10.

    But even hybrids and a SSD/HDD combo will soon be obsolete as the price of SSD's continue to come down. 1tb Samsung 850 SSD for $475 is almost worth going for over a 250gb SSD and 1TB HDD combo now.

    All good then I'll stick with the std HDD's then TBH I'd never even heard of hybrid drives until I started this research for a new PC and don't know that much about SSD's either I'll probably do as you and others said and go for an SSD for the OS though

    M2 storage is faster than SSD drives connected via SATA. Having an M2 connector on the mobo is one of the connectivity features that the premium motherboards offer. M2 will cost more given the actual storage is dearer per gigabyte plus you need to buy a motherboard with M2 connection which are usually the premium boards.

    Going M2 over SSD isn't much of an advantage for gaming unless your on the bleeding edge. You'd get a better performance increase by putting that money towards a better CPU or video card. Only if your overclocking the CPU and running at least one high end video card, no point looking at M2/PCI-E storage as a performance boost.

    Got ya, again I new bugger all about the M.2 stuff before this and from the little bit I'd read wasn't sure if it was worth doing, only really thought about it as the MB I was looking at had provision for it, wont bother wasting money on that either

    Ohh. Didn't think that the U9S and U12S would be the same price. In that case, bigger is better as long as it will fit inside your case. U9S would fit just about any system including mini and possibly Micro ATX.
    Any standard ATX board will take the bigger U12S up to the U15S coolers.

    Yeah a bit strange they are the same $


    Windows 10 sub note.

    There is one thing to consider if your planning on changing to Win 10. It won't be a pleasant experience if your internet download speed is low. Windows 10 needs a lot of big updates and will chew up your bandwidth, The fairly recent v2.6? anniversary update was almost 3 gigs of data if my memory serves. My wife's win 10 laptop is constantly sitting in the corner for hours at a time while it's chewing on updates and I've got a 15.5 megabit per sec download connection. If you have 6 megabit per sec or lower, it's going to be painful.

    Some people are sitting out of win 10 for this reason alone. I've got one customer with 3 computers all sharing a 3.5megabit per second internet connection. They are sitting on win 7 until they get NBN rollout in their area, due July 2019.
    OK that's got me second guessing now We're on ADSL2+ but depending on traffic it can go from ~13mbs down to ~5mbs and wont get NBN till next Feb at the earliest I know what you mean about the updates, this lappy gets really sluggish and freezes when one is ready for download and then is slow while it downloads May have to look at W7 and then upgrade later
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phildo View Post
    Noted. We'll check back on that one in three years
    Quote Originally Posted by filbert View Post
    i'll pretend you didn't know she was 13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Para045 View Post
    OK that's got me second guessing now We're on ADSL2+ but depending on traffic it can go from ~13mbs down to ~5mbs and wont get NBN till next Feb at the earliest I know what you mean about the updates, this lappy gets really sluggish and freezes when one is ready for download and then is slow while it downloads May have to look at W7 and then upgrade later
    You'll be fine on that connection, just be prepared to leave it alone for a few hours. I've done the win 10 download and install process several times on an 8mbps connection.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cone Cat View Post
    Ohh. Didn't think that the U9S and U12S would be the same price. In that case, bigger is better as long as it will fit inside your case. U9S would fit just about any system including mini and possibly Micro ATX.
    Any standard ATX board will take the bigger U12S up to the U15S coolers.
    Just for clarity, micro ATX are bigger than mini ITX boards.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GTSam View Post
    You'll be fine on that connection, just be prepared to leave it alone for a few hours. I've done the win 10 download and install process several times on an 8mbps connection.

    Sent from my SM-A700K using Tapatalk
    If you get the teamos version has win10 with all the updates slipstreamed just have to uninstall activator if you want a legit copy.
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    Also once you've been through this process and got it all up and running, go to https://ninite.com to download your free tools and utilities. By far the best and easiest way to do a fresh install

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